Re: Good news for SPARC/Linux

Larry McVoy (lm@bitmover.com)
Wed, 16 Dec 1998 16:29:19 -0800


Yes, I killfile-ed you, I only am responding because someone forwarded
your mail and suggested I make my position clear. I'm not sure it is
a great idea, but I respect the person who mailed me so here goes.

: It was even your right to killfile me,
: although that was an astonishingly childish thing to do. Face it:
: normal people killfile people who are persistently abusive and grossly
: breach netiquette. It is more than stretching it to say I've behaved
: like that. If it really is the case that I'm the first person you've
: killfiled for 8 years, I only see one of two possibilites:
: - I have been such an annoying pest on this thread
: - you have a personal grudge/vendetta against me.

You had it right the first time.

: I consider the former unlikely (after all, I made very few posts, did
: not breach netiquette and I've had no negative comments from anyone
: else). I consider the latter likely, given your appalling behaviour a
: few months ago in the RT scheduler thread.

Richard, I don't keep grudges against people. That's just
counterproductive for everyone involved. I judge code, not people.
I differentiate strongly between "_that_ is a dump idea" and "_you_ are
a dumb person". I'll cop to saying the former repeatedly. On the rare
occasions that I say the latter, shame on me, there is no excuse for that.
Lest you be confused, I don't think you are dumb, but I definitely think
you say some dumb things.

My reason for killfiling you, since you've essentially publicly asked,
is that I find interacting with you painful. You talk too much about
things you haven't thought about enough, and you have a tendency to argue
in public - your post is a great point. Why on earth would you need
to post this to the kernel group? They don't need to hear this crap.
Every time I take it private, you drag it out in public.

The Sun stuff is another case. You have no idea what is going on behind
the scenes and that's because Sun doesn't feel the need for you to know.
There's more going on than you know and even after I've broadly hinted
that that is the case, you persist in speaking athoritatively about
something about which you have no information on and with which you have
no involvement. Imagine what this list would be like if everyone felt
compelled, as you seem to, to speak up about things about which they
have no information.

As to the RT stuff, I stand by my former position. I think it is insane
to try and wedge pseudo real time support into a time sharing system.
You can't get what you want, you can only approximate it. That's not
real time, you've just latched onto the term. If you want real time, use
real time Linux - it's what it is there for. What you are doing with your
pseudo RT stuff is the same sort of bloat that makes operating systems die
- one line of code at a time, all the while accompanied with protests of
"I measured it, you can't tell the difference, and I have a customer who
``needs'' this". All very well intended, but a bad idea all the same.

Here's a quote for you:

``Although people have tried to mix time-sharing and real-time
functionality in one operating system, the results have been
compromises in features and utility because of the _obvious_
conflicts in the requirements of the two system.''

-- Operating System Concepts, 3rd edition, p 23.

This just the first OS book I picked up that had something to say about
RT. You might also read the MERT paper which date all the way back to
1977; they were the inspiration for RT Linux.

My issue with you, Richard, is that you repeatedly aggressively state
things which you either (a) know nothing about [e.g. the Sun stuff], or
(b) are clearly wrong on and refuse to look at history to see where you
are wrong. In my opinion, thinking such as yours is the primary reason
that operating systems become large, bloated, and buggy. One line of
code at a time, and one customer ``feature'' at a time. Yuck. No thanks.

It's just my opinion, it's my problem that I can't get you to see
``the one true path,'' and while it is a total copout and a failure to
communicate on my part, the only reasonable thing that I can do is to
ignore you. I live in hope that you will develop a taste for history and
will see why some of these things that I see to be true actually are true,
and we can then get back to real work instead of this childish nonsense.

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